Newbie Auto 'Box Installation Help Please!

bigdawgv8 · Post by **bigdawgv8** » Tue Jan 29, 2008 9:24 pm

Hi,

After years of working with manual 'boxes I'm now about to fit a V8 and auto 'box into a 1971 Morris Minor Pick-up..........

I have never had to mate up an Auto before so need advice please.

What is the procedure for bolting up an auto box to an engine???

Engine is 1991 Range Rover 3.9 V8 Auto
Box is Borg Warner 65
I have a variety of flex-plates and spacers to use

Thanks for any advice guys!

Cheers

BD

plastic orange · Post by **plastic orange** » Tue Jan 29, 2008 11:32 pm

You will have to use the flex plate that goes with the torque converter for your box. I'm sure the 35 and 65 convertors are the same fitment (as must the flex plate be), but the GM 180 is different. There are thick and thin spacers, but I can't really remember what goes with what (Guessing thick spacer is for GM). (changed a GM 180 to BW 65 a few years ago, but have forgotten).
I've found the best way to connect things is to locate the convertor on the box, then attach box to engine, then fit the torque converter bolts through the flex plate from below. That way you are sure the converter tangs are located in the pump in the box.
Hope this helps.

Pete

bigdawgv8 · Post by **bigdawgv8** » Wed Jan 30, 2008 8:37 pm

Thanks for the help Pete.

Posts on another site (which I can't access for some reason!) talk about allowing some 'play' between torque convertor and gearbox drive (tangs) - ''not too much play and not too tight''
Is this right? If so how do I know how much play is correct and how do I measure it?

Cheers

BD

plastic orange · Post by **plastic orange** » Wed Jan 30, 2008 10:25 pm

When you locate the torque converter in the box, you will know when it is located properly. If you look at the converter there are 2 tangs on the box side, which if you look into the box there is a corresponding 2 slots.
Never done anything apart from fit it and bolt it up, so can't comment on clearance issues you mention. Perhaps there may in some cars be shims you fit between flex plate and converter, but if correct spacers are used it should all fit fine.
When the box is bolted to the engine, you should be able to move the flex plate/flywheel without turning the converter - until you put the bolts in.

Pete

JSF55 · Post by **JSF55** » Wed Jan 30, 2008 10:53 pm

When i took my GM180 out there was a spacer between the flex plate and the crank, i just refiited this when i put it back in, with fitting the torque convertor, if u can stand the box on the tail shaft and drop the convertor in, give it a few turns in each direction and u should here/see it drop in, to check run a level across the bellhousing face and make sure the fixing tabs are lower than the face

leepop633 · Post by **leepop633** » Thu Jan 31, 2008 5:02 pm

Is it a zf 4 spd auto box? Im assuming it is as its a 3.9. Easiest way to do it is tilt the box up slightly and feed the T/C on as said. There are two locating lugs on the T/C as said. There is three clicks you should hear. Makes you think the T/C is on but it isnt if you hear two. It takes a little fiddling with as each set of splines going into the T/C turn but you can do it easy enough. DONT force the T/C onto the shafts just be gentle as if you push it hard then it may damage the pump.

leepop633 · Post by **leepop633** » Thu Jan 31, 2008 5:04 pm

Ignore me, just read its a BW65, lol. Ive got a rangie maunal hear if you need any thing out of it but why dont you use a z4 auto box? Take off the tail end, use a bmw tail end and sump then you have a 4 speed auto insetad of three. Better for crusing. I got a ZF here for sale.

ChrisJC · Post by **ChrisJC** » Thu Jan 31, 2008 8:50 pm

Not quite sure it's as easy as that to convert a 4WD box to a 2WD box. I could be completely wrong here as I've never done it, but I suspect that you need to change the output shaft to do that. And to change the output shaft means completely removing all the gearsets.......

If you get a Sherpa ZF4HP22 then it's got a much heavier duty tailcone and also a speedo drive which the BMW ones don't have as far as I know.

Chris.

leepop633 · Post by **leepop633** » Fri Feb 01, 2008 1:28 pm

ChrisJC wrote:Not quite sure it's as easy as that to convert a 4WD box to a 2WD box. I could be completely wrong here as I've never done it, but I suspect that you need to change the output shaft to do that. And to change the output shaft means completely removing all the gearsets.......

If you get a Sherpa ZF4HP22 then it's got a much heavier duty tailcone and also a speedo drive which the BMW ones don't have as far as I know.

Chris.

The only difference between the Sherpa ZF4 and the landy one is the transfer box. It just unbolts and you left with the output shaft. You could use a sherpa one as its the same box although the numbers on the box tells you by searching the gearing inside but wont make that much difference. I havent dont this conversion myself but was going to do it when i was going to use a RV8 in my thames van. You do need to change the sump as the landy sump is quite big but the beemer one is alot flatter.

bigdawgv8 · Post by **bigdawgv8** » Sun Feb 03, 2008 8:56 pm

Ok guys,

Thanks for all the info.

Give it a go over the next few weeks!

Cheers

BD

Eliot · Post by **Eliot** » Mon Feb 04, 2008 5:46 am

bigdawgv8 wrote:Thanks for the help Pete.

Posts on another site (which I can't access for some reason!) talk about allowing some 'play' between torque convertor and gearbox drive (tangs) - ''not too much play and not too tight''
Is this right? If so how do I know how much play is correct and how do I measure it?

Cheers

BD

On the GM boxes i'm familiar with (TH350,400,700r4,4l80e) - this is correct. Usally allow about 1/8" clearance - The t/c shouldn't be hard-up against the plate.
I believe its to allow the t/c to expand (ballooning).

4x4x383 · Post by **4x4x383** » Mon Feb 04, 2008 9:45 am

This was something I didn't bother to check once, and after a while the oil pump on the TH350 broke.

I repaired it and fitted a shim between the engine and box, and had no more trouble.

bigdawgv8 · Post by **bigdawgv8** » Sun Feb 24, 2008 9:06 pm

Ok,

Went for it today and it all came together (!) well.

Gearbox mated up ok, and I could turn torque convertor until the holes..................................................didn't line up!

The Torque Convertor bolt holes are further apart than the holes in the flex-plate.
The standard BW65 flex-plate won't fit straight on the late 3.9 Auto crank so I fitted the Range Rover one as the hole spacing ''LOOKED'' the same

Only ways out I can see are
1) Machine centre of BW65 flex-plate to fit Range Rover crank spacer
2) Make up a new crank spacer and use longer flywheel bolts to bolt the flex-plate on.

Anyone got round this problem before?

Cheers

Martin

bigdawgv8 · Post by **bigdawgv8** » Sun Feb 24, 2008 9:08 pm

Ok,

Went for it today and it all came together (!) well.

Gearbox mated up ok, and I could turn torque convertor until the holes..................................................didn't line up!

The Torque Convertor bolt holes are further apart than the holes in the flex-plate.
The standard BW65 flex-plate won't fit straight on the late 3.9 Auto crank so I fitted the Range Rover one as the hole spacing ''LOOKED'' the same

Only ways out I can see are
1) Machine centre of BW65 flex-plate to fit Range Rover crank spacer
2) Make up a new crank spacer and use longer flywheel bolts to bolt the flex-plate on.

Anyone got round this problem before?

Cheers

Martin

JSF55 · Post by **JSF55** » Sun Feb 24, 2008 10:37 pm

It "should" have bolted directly to the crank ? or maybe with a thin spacer, i don't think theres any diffrence in crank ends, other than having a spigot bearing in there for the manual boxes, john