Some Guidence to start costing up....

Behold · Post by **Behold** » Sun Aug 17, 2008 11:15 am

Ok Im new on here and thought this is a good place to start.

I have a Vauxhall Senator (Basically a carlton shell with a longer tail end)

I know what your thinking... why.... Well i have a rare kit for the car and it does look like nothing else on the road. Presently im bored of the S6 3.0 24v and i always wanted a chevy v8 under the bonnet of a car.

So as a thought i want to price up the parts and labour im going to need if this is my chosen route.

Preferably i would like an LS1 engine as there widely tunable and a very proven engine but its not a must. now i know to fit it under the bonnet i will need to either alter the sub frame or run a dry or modified sump. Other from that it should with little amendment to bits like mounts fit straight in. My real problem is understanding which is the cheapest option on gearboxes and diffs that will withstand the power and should i make up a new prop or is there ones i can use.....

Also any other tips that my benifit or companys able to aid me in this.

Thanks

Behold

kiwicar · Post by **kiwicar** » Sun Aug 17, 2008 3:51 pm

I would think your best bet would be a 5.3 version of the ls1 engine with box, can make virtually the same power as the 5.7 but go for about $1000 less than the 5.7. buy one with a gearbox as a package and you are sorted for that, the T56 is a big gear box though and may be necessary to modify the transmission tunnel to fit it in, the auto is smaller. Just have to get a prop shaft made up. There are some good prices on 5.7 crate engines from Australia at the moment on e-bay but you would need to find a T56 or the auto jobby.
Mike

Behold · Post by **Behold** » Sun Aug 17, 2008 5:19 pm

kiwicar wrote:I would think your best bet would be a 5.3 version of the ls1 engine with box, can make virtually the same power as the 5.7 but go for about $1000 less than the 5.7. buy one with a gearbox as a package and you are sorted for that, the T56 is a big gear box though and may be necessary to modify the transmission tunnel to fit it in, the auto is smaller. Just have to get a prop shaft made up. There are some good prices on 5.7 crate engines from Australia at the moment on e-bay but you would need to find a T56 or the auto jobby.
Mike

the tunnel is not to problematic thats not too much work.

What is everyone using as Diffs and drive shafts? im taking it new rear hubs will be needed too.

kiwicar · Post by **kiwicar** » Sun Aug 17, 2008 7:36 pm

I'm sure someone from the appropriate side of the planet will confirm this but I believe that body/ chassis combination had a 5.7 genII (LT1) chevy small block dropped in it with a beafed up T5 and was called a holden commadore in Australia.
I think a couple of people over here have done just that over here (or at least with the genI)
Since you have been running a 24v 3litre engine through the rest of the running gear then to start with I would run with that (unless the 3 litre was a swap onto 2 litre running gear). Hubs should be OK (might want to renew the bearings with Timken if they are old). Diff, change it when you break it

, but that depends on how you drive

, if you are dumping the clutch on a loose surface then that'll be about 10 seconds, use it for embarrassing BMW driving merchant bankers then should last quite a while. Might want to look out for a crash wrecked Monaro for the diff and hubs later on though.
Mike

Behold · Post by **Behold** » Mon Aug 18, 2008 11:00 pm

Yeah got my eye on a few crashed monaro's

The diff i know will not last. there is the option of a Lotus Carlton diff as there good for about 450 HP and they bolt straight on. And finding one for me will not be hard as im surounded by LC's in my car club.

that should solve it then. Engine and Box from a monaro or crate. and an LC diff. take and LC prop and reflange ill be laughing.

im estimating about 6k for parts. 5k for box and engine and about 1k for other bits diff. prop work ETC. then some time welding and cuting the car up!!! LOL

what else do i need to consider????

Behold · Post by **Behold** » Mon Aug 18, 2008 11:03 pm

OH to add.

Brakes should be fine as there uprated. suspension could do with upgrading i guess.

And so you know the car was always a 3litre so its built to take some abuse. And dumping the clutch may be a thing of the past if i can get enough power. just the accelerater may be needed!!!

CastleMGBV8 · Post by **CastleMGBV8** » Wed Aug 20, 2008 4:27 pm

From memory the rear axle in the Lotus carlton is I believe a US Ford 8" or similar so you'd need a complete axle with the appropriate ratio.

Kevin

Flat Eric · Post by **Flat Eric** » Wed Oct 01, 2008 3:47 pm

RE the sump.
Where do you need the extra space.
Generally for different applications there are different shapes they are not flat (eg shaped to avoid steering rack)

LS1
On Monaros the shape of sump pan is shallow at back of engine
On Corvettes the shape of sump pan is shallow at front of engine
On an ARM dry sump pan
http://www.drysump.com/index1.htm overall it is shallower, but the shallow section is deeper than than the shallow section of wet sump pan (if that makes sense).

Flat Eric · Post by **Flat Eric** » Mon Oct 20, 2008 8:39 am

This may help
http://www.ls1tech.com/forums/showthread.php?t=817787

Behold · Post by **Behold** » Wed Jul 08, 2009 12:37 pm

Right time to drag this back up as money is available again!!!

I have been looking at the posts here and can answe rthe sump issue with i have a crossmember right throught the center of where the engine sits so i believe unless i remount the engine forward some more it will fowl most of the designs. but modifying this should not be hard.

As said in austraila there are 5.7v8 versions of the senator but the front subframe is completly different.

Im still toying with just getting an LC diff and hubs as it will bolt straight on and just need to modify the prop. as to the transmision im thinking thats where alot of work will be required to remount the gearbox and widen the tunnel. anyone got the T56 dimensions???

kev_the_mole · Post by **kev_the_mole** » Wed Jul 08, 2009 3:41 pm

No sizes but good T56 info from the manufacturers website here http://www.ttcautomotive.com/English/pr ... 56.asp#Car

If the T56 is too big or you don't want to mess around with cutting the trans tunnel then a TKO 500/600 should fit a treat but they're only available as aftermarket.

Behold · Post by **Behold** » Wed Jul 08, 2009 10:10 pm

The TKO is a solid bit of kit and would take most abuse i could throw at it.

Either is fine i rekon. The LT1 engine vs the LS1 is there going to be a big dissapointment with the LT????

kiwicar · Post by **kiwicar** » Thu Jul 09, 2009 10:04 am

LT1 is just a refreshed SBC, Iron block, just the water flows the other way, some modifications to the oil pump arrangment and an update on the heads. If I was going SBC I would stick with the Gen 1 as there are more aftermarket parts for it. There is no real differance in power between the old SBC and the LT1. If going LS* then pick what is readily available. The LS, realistically, for a given level of drivability/ tune on the road will probably beat the SBC/LT1 by 75 to 100 bhp, certainly up to 500 BHP it is just a so much better design.
Mike

Behold · Post by **Behold** » Thu Jul 09, 2009 2:43 pm

I spoke to a company near me today that would do the conversion. they see no issue in doing the conversion and think its a 2-3 day solid job for engine/gearbox fitted and running. with out exhaust.

Thay have suggested picking up a chevy block from a truck as there alot cheaper and if its to be tuned anyway you will be changing most of the parts that are required anyway. Apparently there is a company near here that supplies used blocks.

I think the LS1 is going to blow my budget. So SBC or LT1 i guess is going to be my option. if there is little difference then which ever comes up first.

The next thing is finding a Diff... It looks like my cheapest option is an Lotus Carlton setup as it is just bolt on.

Is there anything i should watch out for????

kiwicar · Post by **kiwicar** » Thu Jul 09, 2009 4:05 pm

To quote myself

kiwicar wrote: If I was going SBC I would stick with the Gen 1 as there are more aftermarket parts for it. There is no real differance in power between the old SBC and the LT1.

And as there are more gen1s about they tend to be cheeper. I would be inclined to get a set of decent aftermarket Ally heads (there are some real bargins on ebay at the moment), and an ally waterpump and inlet manifold, the weight saving would be worth it in the carlton shell.
Mike