3.5 v8 EFI Flapper

bodger · Post by **bodger** » Fri Sep 28, 2007 11:37 am

lpg conversion on a budget , what do i need and any instructions would be most welcome ..
what sort of mixer ? , in front of the airflow meter or on the plenum ?
what sort of vap and the like ...
please

getting 13 mpg and skint

kiwicar · Post by **kiwicar** » Sat Sep 29, 2007 7:21 am

13 MPG sounds like the EFI is in limp home mode. Before you put an LPG conversion on it I would check the fuel injection is working as well as it can, you will have to sort it anyway when you have to set up the epg.
Mike

bodger · Post by **bodger** » Sat Sep 29, 2007 3:48 pm

13 mpg is good , but it's in an LDV400 camper , slippery as a brick ..lol

kiwicar · Post by **kiwicar** » Sat Sep 29, 2007 4:20 pm

Ah sorry I was thinking range rover, didn't realise it was powering a small house

Mike

bodger · Post by **bodger** » Sun Sep 30, 2007 6:04 pm

ChrisJC · Post by **ChrisJC** » Mon Oct 01, 2007 9:24 am

Hi Bodger,
OK, I have a Flapper EFi with LPG conversion in my sherpa, although it's only the 200 series (a smaller brick!).

I've spent ages & a small fortune fiddling around trying to get something that works OK.

Get a plenum mixer, as the hole in the flapper-mounted mixer is tiny and kills performance. Then you need a flap opener as well, and a vacuum reservoir so the thing opens even when you've got your foot down.

Buy the mixer and vapouriser as a matched pair as I spent ages trying to get the mixture adjustment to work properly (I ended up blocking 50% of the holes in the mixer to stop it running rich).

Performance will suffer, and so will MPG. I doubt if you'll see as much as 10MPG on LPG.

Tinley tech are the cheapest I have come across for new stuff, but I'm sure you can get something of e-bay. Just get the mixer & vapouriser from the same seller!

You'll need some new pipe (which should be insulated) as well, and you'll need to borrow an exhaust gas analyser to set it up.

Chris.

bodger · Post by **bodger** » Mon Oct 01, 2007 1:04 pm

thankyou chris , i have already bought some bits

i have the opener and a mixer ..the plate one ..doh
a manual restrictor too and some 6mm covered copper pipe

these bits are what i have so far :
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll? ... IBSA:UK:31

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll? ... IBSA:UK:11

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll? ... IBSA:UK:11

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll? ... IBSA:UK:11

what i need now is a tank , with valve hopefully , iv'e got my eye on a kit of a transit on ebay ..use what i can and flog the rest
shut off valve , and of course a vaporiser , what sort of flow am i looking for ?

a switch , do's it need to be a proper switch , i have read somewhere that you can insert a relay into the injection system relay and just switch between the 2 fuels ....?
that was on chris perfects website , i thought it was your site at first Chris ..
do you have any fitting instructions or just a wiring diagram i could copy please chris ?

ChrisJC · Post by **ChrisJC** » Mon Oct 01, 2007 2:15 pm

Hmm, I don't know how to spec a vapouriser to make sure it matches a mixer. Suck it & see I guess.

Pipe is good. That seller talks borrox about improving performance and MPG. Utter rubbish. You'll lose both, but gain on fuel cost!

You need a bit more than a switch. You need a safety relay thing that shuts the gas off automatically if the engine stalls. So if you crash, you don't end up spilling gas.........

That bit should have a wiring diagram with it........
Then the changeover switch is just that, a switch that switches off one system and switches on the other. All I did to shut off the EFi system was to interrupt the wire between coil -ve and the ECU. I reused the overrun cutoff relay, just moved the control wire to the safety thing.

You don't need a flap opener with that mixer as you put the mixer on the air filter side of the flap. You do need the backfire valve (or leave some hose clips loose!

Chris.

bodger · Post by **bodger** » Mon Oct 01, 2007 2:26 pm

thanks again chris , do you mean the wire that shuts the fuel on the over run ?
what rating is the vaporiser you finally used ?
i was looking at this one :

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Lpg-Autogas-Vapor ... dZViewItem

and would this do as a cutoff valve :

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Lpg-Shutoff-Valve ... dZViewItem

i still the original inertior switch from the ambulance to switch it ?

bodger · Post by **bodger** » Wed Oct 03, 2007 3:48 pm

hi chris , got it ...no bad for 50quid ...

http://www.putfile.com/keith-17/images/150625

the tank was off the cradle when i got it , do you know if the filler/ valve housing has to be at the top ? or like the picture ...thankyou

ChrisJC · Post by **ChrisJC** » Thu Oct 04, 2007 7:20 am

I've put some pics of my install at http://www.cowdery.org.uk/lpg.php

If you've got a flapper system, you don't need any of that emulation junk.

There should be a mark on the tank indicating top. The valve area should be at about the angle shown in the picture. If you get it wrong, it will either under-fill or over-fill the tank.

I use an OMVL R/90E vapouriser on both Landie and Van. But as I said, I had to block 1/2 the holes in the mixer on the van to get the mixture in the right range.

And the safety thing is a 'timer relay' which has a feed from the coil to keep it alive. When the coil stops firing, it opens some relay contacts which you use to cut off the LPG.

Chris.

bodger · Post by **bodger** » Thu Oct 04, 2007 12:54 pm

thankyou once again chris most helpful , has your tank got a little bracket thingy for want of a better description welded to the bottom ?, off centre on mine

ChrisJC · Post by **ChrisJC** » Thu Oct 04, 2007 2:21 pm

No, the tank is just tank shaped (with the valves & stuff). It's held in place with some straps going to the frame.

In fact there are some lousy pics on here as well:
http://www.cowdery.org.uk/2003rebuild.php

Chris.

bodger · Post by **bodger** » Sat Oct 06, 2007 2:28 am

i did read somewhere how you switched the petrol off ? , any ideas please . i was going to interupt the power to the ecu ?? as that would leave the coil still powered , but do i need to still have power to any part of the efi system , ie: airflow meter to run it on LPG ....?

ChrisJC · Post by **ChrisJC** » Mon Oct 08, 2007 7:39 am

ChrisJC wrote:All I did to shut off the EFi system was to interrupt the wire between coil -ve and the ECU. I reused the overrun cutoff relay, just moved the control wire to the safety thing.

I checked over the weekend - there is a blue / white wire coming from the overrun shutoff relay, and I have connected this wire so that the relay disconnects the ignition system from the ECU when the engine is running on LPG. The entire EFi system is left powered, it's just this relay turns it on & off.

You'll probably need a circuit of the EFi system to figure out exactly how it's done - my blue / white wire disappears into my LPG loom and I can't remember what I connected it to.

Chris.