I want to build an engine: Need help with picking parts

yonexsp · Post by **yonexsp** » Tue Jan 31, 2012 5:36 pm

Eliot wrote:tell you what, i'lll send you an old rover lump in exchange for an ls1/6 !

A 4.6 lump with top hat liners?

ChrisJC · Post by **ChrisJC** » Tue Jan 31, 2012 7:27 pm

I'd go 4.6. In the Range Rover P38 it red-lines at 5000, which ought to be enough. 225BHP and 300lbft.

Chris.

yonexsp · Post by **yonexsp** » Thu Feb 02, 2012 1:40 pm

So, once you have an old 4.0 Block, and have stripped it down.

What suggestion for the following:

1) 4.6 Crankshaft, will it bolt straight in? Where to buy the right Crankshaft
2) CAM Shaft. What one to use? Piper??
3) Efi Setup, Hotwire or Megasquirt
4) Standard or ported heads?
5) Exhaust, do they make Hedman Headers for the SD1? Will RR ones fit?

Thx

kiwicar · Post by **kiwicar** » Thu Feb 02, 2012 2:37 pm

Hi
Avoid the 4.0 blocks they are poor quality versions of the 4.6 blocks where the cores have shifted in casting, and are even more prone to cracking. If you have to have a large journal engine go for a 4.6 block
1/ a large journal crank will fit in a block for a 4.0 or a 4.6
2/ something around 215 to 225 degrees at .05" lift should be good for a 4.6 that will still be street driven
3/ Megasquirt
4/ ported heads stage 1 basic job
5/ yes you can get headermans for the rover engine , certainly for the range rover and I would bet for the SD1, if not then rimmers or someone similar will do them. RR ones would drag on the ground.
Best regards
Mike

yonexsp · Post by **yonexsp** » Thu Feb 02, 2012 9:52 pm

Are all the 4.6 Blocks cross bolted?

With all the horror stories of slipped liners, buying a used block seems fraught with danger

ChrisJC · Post by **ChrisJC** » Fri Feb 03, 2012 8:24 am

yonexsp wrote:Are all the 4.6 Blocks cross bolted?

With all the horror stories of slipped liners, buying a used block seems fraught with danger

It is, either get one that has been pressure tested, or top-hat linered.

They have to be pressure tested 'hot', i.e. at operating temperature.

Chris.

yonexsp · Post by **yonexsp** » Fri Feb 03, 2012 3:29 pm

ChrisJC wrote:
yonexsp wrote:Are all the 4.6 Blocks cross bolted?

With all the horror stories of slipped liners, buying a used block seems fraught with danger
It is, either get one that has been pressure tested, or top-hat linered.

They have to be pressure tested 'hot', i.e. at operating temperature.

Chris.

That is the problem buying a used engine of ebay etc. No way of checking it before you buy it.

I asked a local seller the question, and the response i got was

"this is a ran-tested motor while it was in the vehicle and does not have a cracked block.

thanks"

Not really confidence inspiring. I have asked them for further details, but I suspect they started the car, and that was good enough for them.

DaveEFI · Post by **DaveEFI** » Fri Feb 03, 2012 4:16 pm

I really don't know how common it is to have liner problems. On here, so many are dealing with tuned engines rather than stock. With so many around, even a few will get a mention, and it's all too easy to think they all do that.

So wonder if it's 1%, 10%, 20%? Or whatever? To decide on the risk?

FWIW my '97 BMW has a Nikasil engine and is fine. If you read up on them you'd think they all failed days after they left the factory.

yonexsp · Post by **yonexsp** » Fri Feb 03, 2012 4:55 pm

DaveEFI wrote:I really don't know how common it is to have liner problems. On here, so many are dealing with tuned engines rather than stock. With so many around, even a few will get a mention, and it's all too easy to think they all do that.

So wonder if it's 1%, 10%, 20%? Or whatever? To decide on the risk?

FWIW my '97 BMW has a Nikasil engine and is fine. If you read up on them you'd think they all failed days after they left the factory.

I still don't fancy spending $1500 for a used engine that could be shagged. But if it has all the bits on it, I guess it could be worth the risk.

DaveEFI · Post by **DaveEFI** » Fri Feb 03, 2012 5:22 pm

Buying anything secondhand is a risk. Some parts dealers give a warranty. But if you want less risk you have to find the money for new. Your choice.

ChrisJC · Post by **ChrisJC** » Fri Feb 03, 2012 7:09 pm

I have bought 4 blocks of the suspect type:
1. From RPi, a dealer. Guaranteed not to be cracked, and it wasn't. Still isn't, 8 years later
2. From eBay. Said not to be cracked, just a 'head gasket failure'. I tested it myself, pushed out a liner, and found a 1" crack.
3. From eBay. Still a complete engine, so unknow.
4. Complete vehicle, no indication of a crack (i.e. no water loss) 30,000 miles after purchase.

So, I have 1 failure, 2 OK and one unknown.

If you want to be sure, buy one from a dealer that has been tested. Or buy a cheap one, and if it turns out to be cracked, pony up £800 to have it top-hat linered.

Chris.

yonexsp · Post by **yonexsp** » Fri Feb 03, 2012 11:06 pm

So new block not included, as I'm interested in used.

You have 50% failure rate of tested units, 33% failure for untested included used units.

Not the best lol!!!

ChrisJC · Post by **ChrisJC** » Sat Feb 04, 2012 8:48 am

yonexsp wrote:So new block not included, as I'm interested in used.

You have 50% failure rate of tested units, 33% failure for untested included used units.

Not the best lol!!!

Indeed!, one has to budget for it!, rather than leave it to chance!

Chris.

yonexsp · Post by **yonexsp** » Tue Feb 07, 2012 1:06 am

New bare block, or short block seems to be the way to go.

This woudl be mt dream engine. If I thought I could get close to this sound and power for $3000- $4000 I'd do it

http://tinyurl.com/7wnvmpw

ChrisJC · Post by **ChrisJC** » Tue Feb 07, 2012 8:31 am

That is an advert for RPi, from whom I bought my first (and still good) block from.

Chris.