Rover V8 Mk1 Escort cooling diagram?

Ian Anderson · Post by **Ian Anderson** » Mon Sep 03, 2012 12:50 pm

Spal fans good but pricy
http://www.a1electric.com/catalog/cat_spal.htm

Evil bay - but what quality / guarantee
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Electric-Radi ... 5d33a11852

Car Builder Solutions - good reputation
http://www.cbsonline.co.uk/category/Fans,b.html

S-V-C - again good reputation and Pacit fans
http://www.s-v-c.co.uk/product/pacet-16--pro-/

No doubt many more places including scrappies

Looking again at your radiator it does look fairly small side to side
What sort of core measuremet is it?

And rule of thumb is
1/3 of radiator area needed for grill
2/3 of radiator area needed for exit of air (past engine etc!

Ian

DEVONMAN · Post by **DEVONMAN** » Mon Sep 03, 2012 4:32 pm

Coming back to the plumbing, from the pictures it appears that you have 3 way that coolant can bypass the radiator. If this is the case then there is a lot of hot coolant flowing back into the engine without passing through the radiator. Try clamping the pipe that comes up from the thermostat housing to the plastic tank and see if you get an improvement in cooling.

I assume one of the bypass hoses is through the heater and if so you could reduce the flow slightly through this to help radiator flow.

Cheers
Denis

macd68 · Post by **macd68** » Tue Sep 04, 2012 10:45 am

Thanks to everyone that passed on suggestions.

Getting cold air and hot air out is the main challenge, so I'll look at the fan/radiator options as suggested. I think bonnet vents would help too, but I would prefer to keep the stock look if possible, so this is a last resort.

Denis,
Thanks for the suggestion. I'll try to clamp one hose and see what happens. The original questions was about the plumbing, which I found confusing. The fluid seems to pump into the header tank when the engine is running, rather than round the radiator, though if I keep the caps on and the header tank fills up it should eventually make it into the radiator, though there is a loop from the header tank on teh suction side of the pump, and also from the block, so as you say fluid could circulate around the block/header tank without being forced to run through the radiator.

By the way, what is the optimal temperature to run these engines at, as I've seen suggestions from 85Degc to 100 DegC.

Cheers,

Donald

DaveEFI · Post by **DaveEFI** » Tue Sep 04, 2012 12:14 pm

My SD1 EFI is 88C. Earlier SD1 IIRC 84C. But, of course, that makes no difference if the system allows it to go above that temp.

mgbv8 · Post by **mgbv8** » Tue Sep 04, 2012 9:04 pm

macd68 wrote:Thanks to everyone that passed on suggestions.

Getting cold air and hot air out is the main challenge, so I'll look at the fan/radiator options as suggested. I think bonnet vents would help too, but I would prefer to keep the stock look if possible, so this is a last resort.

Denis,
Thanks for the suggestion. I'll try to clamp one hose and see what happens. The original questions was about the plumbing, which I found confusing. The fluid seems to pump into the header tank when the engine is running, rather than round the radiator, though if I keep the caps on and the header tank fills up it should eventually make it into the radiator, though there is a loop from the header tank on teh suction side of the pump, and also from the block, so as you say fluid could circulate around the block/header tank without being forced to run through the radiator.

By the way, what is the optimal temperature to run these engines at, as I've seen suggestions from 85Degc to 100 DegC.

Cheers,

Donald

Regardless of temperature or pressure in the cooling system, if there is a difference in the pressure between the two pipes to the header tank (either side of the water pump) water will flow and by pass the rad. All you need is an expansion tank so this needs only one connection from the cooling system. This should be from the top of the cooling system. Ideally from the top of the rad or the pipe between rad and top hose connection to the thermostat.

macd68 · Post by **macd68** » Wed Sep 05, 2012 9:17 am

Thanks Perry.

That's pretty much what I thought, and what I have seen elsewhere, hence the original question about how the RV8 is normally plumbed in. It didn't make sense to me, but I thought I might be missing a trick about the RV8 and how it is normally set up.

If somebody could describe how they are normally plumbed, I'll replicate that and see how it looks.
- Rad bottom hose to water pump suction side.
- Rad top hose to thermostat housing.
- Hose from radiator cap to the bottom of the expansion tank.
- etc
- etc

It will probably mean a new expansion tank as this one has a number of outlets, but thee can be blocked of temporarlily while I try out a different setup.

Thanks,

Donald

DaveEFI · Post by **DaveEFI** » Wed Sep 05, 2012 9:42 am

Dunno if it makes a difference, but on my SD1 factory set-up, the connection to the expansion tank is at the top. More or less level with the output from the rad.

mgbv8 · Post by **mgbv8** » Wed Sep 05, 2012 10:12 am

DaveEFI wrote:Dunno if it makes a difference, but on my SD1 factory set-up, the connection to the expansion tank is at the top. More or less level with the output from the rad.

Same on my MGB.

And on the boys Escort V8 I just made a joining section of copper in the top hose and brazed a stub of 8mm copper in. That runs gently uphill to the exp tank. Works a treat.

DEVONMAN · Post by **DEVONMAN** » Wed Sep 05, 2012 6:39 pm

DaveEFI wrote:Dunno if it makes a difference, but on my SD1 factory set-up, the connection to the expansion tank is at the top. More or less level with the output from the rad.

It would seem more sensible to connect to the expansion tank at the bottom so that air is not sucked back into the rad as the coolant cools down. However, it would still work as the air will go back into the expansion tank next time the coolant heats up again and expands.

I wonder if there is a drop tube inside the SD1 expansions tank thereby forcing coolant and not air back to the rad on cooling?
Any chance you could have a look Dave?

Cheers Denis

SimpleSimon · Post by **SimpleSimon** » Wed Sep 05, 2012 7:49 pm

DEVONMAN wrote:Coming back to the plumbing, from the pictures it appears that you have 3 way that coolant can bypass the radiator. If this is the case then there is a lot of hot coolant flowing back into the engine without passing through the radiator. Try clamping the pipe that comes up from the thermostat housing to the plastic tank and see if you get an improvement in cooling.

I assume one of the bypass hoses is through the heater and if so you could reduce the flow slightly through this to help radiator flow.

Cheers
Denis

That expansion bottle should have reducers (like roll pins) in the top outlets/nipples of that expansion bottle they are fitted to give the outlets some body and stem the flow

and hopefully reduce what you have suggested Devonman

DaveEFI · Post by **DaveEFI** » Wed Sep 05, 2012 10:18 pm

The one on my SD1 (brass as it's an air-con car) is just a plain stub going into the tank. I'm certain of that because I've had to re-solder it.

mgbv8 · Post by **mgbv8** » Fri Sep 07, 2012 4:13 pm

I use an SD1 metal exp tank on mine. Its the same as the factory MGB V8 tank but a bit wider. The connection into the exp tank from the rad is at the top of the exp tank. But this is a dip tube that goes to the bottom of the exp tank. From a new cold fill you make sure that the exp tank is about 1/3rd full.
Air and water will bubble into the exp tank via the dip tube as it heats up. And water only will be drawn back in as the engine cools and the water contracts back to its cold state.

Darkspeed · Post by **Darkspeed** » Fri Sep 07, 2012 6:47 pm

I would completely block off that pipe from the rad top to the exp tank - that is the only part that is incorrect.

The connection to the exp tank from the t-stat need to be no more than 3mm orifice

The other parts I cannot see are the 1/2 " connects to the water pump you have the black bypass - what is coming back down the convolute blue pipe?

Andrew

macd68 · Post by **macd68** » Mon Sep 10, 2012 4:30 pm

Hi Andrew,

Sorry for the slow reply - long weekend

The blue convolute pipe that you mention is going to the heater matrix, with the other side of the heater matrix fed into the rear of the engine block.
If I block of the hose from the expansion tank to the radiator, how will the system deal with fluid expansion as it warms? Through the other connectors into the expansion tank I guess?

thanks for all the feedback from everyone. Think I'm even more confused now

Donald

Darkspeed · Post by **Darkspeed** » Mon Sep 10, 2012 5:46 pm

macd68 wrote:Hi Andrew,

Sorry for the slow reply - long weekend

The blue convolute pipe that you mention is going to the heater matrix, with the other side of the heater matrix fed into the rear of the engine block.
If I block of the hose from the expansion tank to the radiator, how will the system deal with fluid expansion as it warms? Through the other connectors into the expansion tank I guess?

thanks for all the feedback from everyone. Think I'm even more confused now

Donald

Exactly - the issue you have is that the rad is on a lower pressure area than the bleed from the manifold and unless the connect to the rad is fully submerged ( flooded) it will flow air from the exp tank into the top of the rad as the fluids expand - you want to lock the air in the tank and compress it

All low pressure connections must be flooded - and the only unflooded connection must be the highest pressure point of the system.

Hope that makes sense.

Andrew