Audi B5 420-R: The Build

Post any info regarding parts for conversion and swaps.
and any posts regarding swaps help.

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unstable load
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Post by unstable load » Mon Feb 08, 2016 4:28 am

Thanks for clarifying, Chris.


Cheers,
John

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Post by Nollywood » Sat Feb 13, 2016 9:03 pm

Update: 13th February, 2016.

Last night, for the first time I started this project, B5 420-R finally fired up.

Some may recall, I ended up with 2 ECU's. I originally intended to use the 2005 D3 4.2 ECU, and had the immobiliser defeated. I later realised the D3 ECU gets it's VSS via the ABS, unlike the B5 / early C5 cars, which had a speed transducer mounted on the front differential.

I also discovered the D3 4.2 V8 40V engine is mechanically similar to the V8 used in the facelift D2 S8, down to the dual-stage intake plenum. Coupled with the fact the D2 S8 ECU will permit a higher redline, and accept a manual coding, it was a no brainier as to which ECU I used.

The S8 ECU is plugged into my car, though the engine only runs for about 3 seconds before shutting down, with the flashing key symbol in my cluster...

...yes, I have not had the immobiliser defeated in the S8 ECU, and this is for one reason. Due to my building a hybrid wiring harness for the D3 40V motor (2000 C5 S6 / 2005 D3 A8) there is potentially more room for error. With a V8 32V, or V8 40V from a D2 or C5, I can pretty much wire these up, and fire up with the whole car ready to drive, no need to leave the front stripped in case I need to check wiring. This is because I have fully mastered what goes where.

If I had the S8 ECU immobiliser defeated BEFORE I'd verified everything was good, and the engine wouldn't run, it would be much more difficult to trouble-shoot. I would have to work out if a non-start condition was due to an error in my wiring, or a bricked ECU by the IMMO-defeat process.

Now I can confidently send the D2 S8 ECU off to get the immobiliser defeated. I would have at least tried the IMMO-defeated D3 ECU, but there are minor differences in the pin-outs, enough to mean re-pinning the ECU connector.

I still need to swap the high-pressure line from the power steering rack to the vane pump, with my C5 RS6 hose, and plumb in my oil cooler (I simply looped the intake and outlets of the C5 RS6 sandwich plate to allow a quick start). Then I can finally fit the lock carrier for the last time, and connect the coolant hoses.
2000 Audi B5 420-R, Pelican Blue:Work In Progress.
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unstable load
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Post by unstable load » Sun Feb 14, 2016 5:45 am

That must have been a really satisfying moment when it lit off and ran.
Well done!
Cheers,
John

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Post by Nollywood » Sun Feb 14, 2016 10:07 am

unstable load wrote:That must have been a really satisfying moment when it lit off and ran.
Well done!
Thanks man. :D
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Post by ChrisJC » Sun Feb 14, 2016 7:02 pm

Indeed well done! I am sure you must be well relieved.

Chris.
--
Series IIA 4.6 V8
R/R P38 4.6 V8

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Post by Nollywood » Fri Feb 19, 2016 10:54 pm

Just starting to wrap things up in Phase I.

With all systems functioning as they should, I can now send off the D2 S8 ME 7.1.1 ECU for its immobiliser defeat. The exhaust is all fitted, though as anyone who knows the B5 2.8 Quattro / S4 well, would be aware the twin pipes to the cats are not equal in length, they are staggered.

I have purchased an extra metre of T304 grade 2.5" stainless pipe, and matching sleeves. I don't want step-downs.

After all this time, the battery is still okay. This will remain in its original location, meaning no C5 RS6 coolant expansion tank, which on RHD cars sits behind the false firewall, in the battery's location (battery sits in the luggage compartment). I will be fitting a new, clean OEM B5 tank in it's original location too. I want the engine bay to look as OEM as possible, the way a factory B5 V8 would have looked.

I still need to decide what to do about my lower front arms - go with new OEM replacements, or get spherical bearings pressed in. Still undecided.

Tie up the front end - fit my oil cooler pipes, C5 RS6 power steering high pressure line, either retaining the original B5 steering fluid resovoir, or fitting a black one from a B6 - I have a spare. Fit my fans, replace B5 cooling fans control module and harness with B5 S4 items, connect hoses, fit lock carrier for good.

I also need to book the car in at my Audi dealership, to get the aircon system charged up. This weekend, I'll be filling up the 01E transmission and B5 RS4 rear differential. I'm picking up a workshop dispensing pump, it makes getting the gear oil into the filler holes a breeze.

I sat in the car last night, while I was checking everything worked, and it felt good. The interior is much nicer than that of my B5 2.5 TDI V6 Quattro, it still smells of supple, well cared for leather. The car should be back on the road next month.

Then on to Phase II.
2000 Audi B5 420-R, Pelican Blue:Work In Progress.
2000 Audi B5 420-R DTM, Santorin Blue: Work In Progress.

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Post by Nollywood » Tue Feb 23, 2016 9:01 pm

Update: 23rd February, 2016.

I shipped my 2001 D2 S8 (ME7.1.1) off yesterday to get the immobiliser defeated. It was received by Vagtronics, who sent me a text alert 20 minutes ago, to let me know it's all done, and is on its way back to me. It will be with me by or before 13:00 hrs tomorrow.

I pulled the front end today (they were not bolted in place) to install my hybrid power steering high-pressure line. I ended up not using the C5 RS6 line. I had to pull the right-hand Milltek decat pipe for improved access, but it was still a bitch. It's one thing removing an existing line, quite a different job fitting a replacement. The worst part of the job (after the grief of actually routing the hose) is getting the banjo and washers in place. Took me almost half an hour getting the thread to take.

I ended up swapping the B5 power steering fluid resovoir for a B6 plain black one.

The rear differential has been filled with fresh oil. The transmission I haven't filled yet, as I have not tied up the oil cooler lines.

I reinstalled the decat pipe, and complete exhaust system is now buttoned up.

I ordered a 7-row oil cooler for my 01E. It doesn't really need to be any larger. I removed one of the C5 RS6 sandwich plate couplings, as I need to visit my hydraulic shop to get a pair of ends for the oil cooler lines. I'm most likely going to mount both oil coolers (engine and trans) under the right-hand frame rail.

Pictures of both oil coolers:

Image

Image

Image
2000 Audi B5 420-R, Pelican Blue:Work In Progress.
2000 Audi B5 420-R DTM, Santorin Blue: Work In Progress.

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Post by Nollywood » Wed Apr 06, 2016 10:01 pm

Due to family and other commitments, B5 420-R took a break.

The biggest issue has been the D3 Audi A8L that has been sitting on my driveway, with a broken engine due to a bust timing belt. Lots of other repairs have needed doing, it's all done now, and I took the car for a drive yesterday, and parked it in the street.

The work left on B5 420-R involves access to the fuse box, which means opening the driver's door fully. This happens to be the side blocked by the wall. I can now drive the B5 out of my garage. The weather's good to work in the open too.

The D3 Limo will be picked up before the week's out. The owner just needs to decide if he wants me to sort out the collapsed rear air suspension, or drive it out away looking like it's about to lay an egg:

Image
2000 Audi B5 420-R, Pelican Blue:Work In Progress.
2000 Audi B5 420-R DTM, Santorin Blue: Work In Progress.

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Post by RAS_666 » Thu Apr 21, 2016 10:21 am

Don't mind me asking I am in the middle of a swap with a d2 v8 and I am upto the radiator and the lost driveshaft part :? I like the way you have done your radiator but just out of interest doesn't the radiator split in 2 parts on the end with the pipes? The standard plastic radiator flows from left to right then back again across the bottom half of the rad. Did you also swap the internal baffles or do the alloy rads not work like that?

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Post by Nollywood » Sat Apr 23, 2016 9:26 pm

RAS_666 wrote:Don't mind me asking I am in the middle of a swap with a d2 v8 and I am upto the radiator and the lost driveshaft part :? I like the way you have done your radiator but just out of interest doesn't the radiator split in 2 parts on the end with the pipes? The standard plastic radiator flows from left to right then back again across the bottom half of the rad. Did you also swap the internal baffles or do the alloy rads not work like that?
I don't 100% understand your query regarding the radiator.

Which D2 engine are you using - 32 or 40V? What chassis are you swapping the engine into?
2000 Audi B5 420-R, Pelican Blue:Work In Progress.
2000 Audi B5 420-R DTM, Santorin Blue: Work In Progress.

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Post by RAS_666 » Sun Apr 24, 2016 9:50 pm

Hi it's a d2 s8 engine code AVP going into a 1998 b5 it is in and running connected to a 6 speed 01e box all that remains is a radiator and reluctantly connecting the exhaust up.

What I mean about the radiator is are they not like this inside?
Image
It is how the standard 1.8 radiator works anyway

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Post by Nollywood » Mon Apr 25, 2016 12:08 am

That radiator set up is similar to my aluminium version.

The original V6 radiator is different, inlet top left, outlet bottom right.

I have discovered that no 2 V8 swaps are the same. I have completed 3 since 2008, this is my 4th, and I have another one to start once this one is finished. That 1 is going to be a stripped-out racer though, with an S8 motor boosted with a single fat snail.

You've probably gone past the wiring stage anyway, but with your swap, I would say you're better off using a C5 S6 ME7.1.1 harness, as it has more in common with a B5. Though as your car is an early one, it'll still require a lot of chassis plug re-pinning.

Any link to your project?
2000 Audi B5 420-R, Pelican Blue:Work In Progress.
2000 Audi B5 420-R DTM, Santorin Blue: Work In Progress.

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Post by RAS_666 » Mon Apr 25, 2016 11:58 am

I used a wiring harness from a c5 s6 from the same year. I got the connectors for the car side from the s6 and a engine harness for the same year and engine as mine and made a little interface harness so I didn't have to change anything in the car other than add the dbw accelerator and what a job that was bolting that thing in there! The only modification to the engine loom was to add the wire for the clutch switch. The only bits not connected now are the can lines ac data lines and crash signal. The engine I got was from a friend he had got it for a project from a burnt car so it came as just a bare block basicly but nice and clean and only 4k on the clock I have had it for about 5 years now finally doing something with it

http://richardasephton.com/20160425_124208.jpg

http://richardasephton.com/20160425_124217.jpg

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Post by Nollywood » Thu Apr 28, 2016 7:25 pm

Due to incompatibility issues between my ECU and harness (ME7.1. versus ME7.1.1) my car ran like ass, worse when warm. I removed the harness, originally to re-pin the connectors, but with so much different, it's not worth the time. It's so much easier to build a new harness from scratch. I have hacked up the harness, retaining just the connectors.

Time to transfer measurements across to my wall nail board. [;)]

I picked up reels of wire in assorted colours and gauge, as well as a bag of assorted VAG harness terminals. I've got rolls of cloth tape already, so it'll all be well wrapped up.

I could have simply replaced the ECU with an ME7.1 unit to match the harness, but I want to retain wideband. On another note, I managed to get hold of a genuine S8 manual ME7.1.1 ECU, so no coding will be required. I just couldn't pass it up at the price the seller was asking for it.

For any interested parties, I have put together the C5 4.2 / S6 ECU pin-outs in chart form, for both the ME7.1 and 7.1.1 variants.

http://www.audizine.com/forum/showthrea ... U-Pin-Outs
2000 Audi B5 420-R, Pelican Blue:Work In Progress.
2000 Audi B5 420-R DTM, Santorin Blue: Work In Progress.

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Post by Nollywood » Thu Apr 28, 2016 7:32 pm

The annual Vehicle Excise Duty on my B5 2.5 TDI V6 Quattro Sport expires on the 30th. I don't really want to renew it, as it's going to be taking the place of my Pelican Blue car - having a D2 S8 motor shoved in, while having the interior gutted.

Back to B5 420-R.

I need to get the immobiliser coded to my keys, as opposed to being deleted. I want to be able to soft code the cluster, which would not be possible if it doesn't get an immobiliser authorisation. It will store it as a code.

I don't like the way the power steering resovoir area is exposed. Sure, it's got a black surround, but still, it could be better. I ordered a full-size cover, which will be delivered sometime tomorrow. I also feel Audi could have done a lot better with their headlamp and lock carrier mounting hardware. They are prone to corrosion.

I have also ordered some stainless steel bolts in the same profile (domed head torx) with the correct washers, to replace Audi's nasties. Looks like this car's going to be ready just in time for summer.

Image

A brand new OEM coolant reservoir makes all the difference too:

Image
2000 Audi B5 420-R, Pelican Blue:Work In Progress.
2000 Audi B5 420-R DTM, Santorin Blue: Work In Progress.

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