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Ian Anderson
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Post by Ian Anderson »

:nw

Paul

Many thanks it is more fascinating every day ( or I am just a sad old git) your explanations are so too the point and reasonably easy to take in for what is a damn slight more technical subject than I thought

Ian :nw :nw :nw


Owner of an "On the Road" GT40 Replica by DAX powered by 3.9Hotwre Efi, worked over by DJ Motors. EFi Working but still does some kangaroo at low revs (Damn the speed limits) In to paint shop 18/03/08.

gelmonkey
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Post by gelmonkey »

Hi All
We have a saying in the marine industry which relates to a certain time of year which runs from the time the boats come out of the water until the time they are relaunched and the saying is..WE are in SILLY SEASON.
My phone has not stopped ringing this week and did not stop until 8pm tonight so even with the best intentions I have not been able to complete all of the glassing.
I have managed to get the side rails and the back end glassed and Ian there are a few pics of different laminates and an explanation of what is used and why at the end ok .

So laminates cut ,side rails wet out we roll the glass along the length.

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We then ease the glass over the sides and tie them into the gelled area.

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Give it a good roller out and we end up with this.

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The same was done on the other side but I seem to have lost that pic somewhere along the line !
The back end was completed in the usual way.

Ian thank you for your interest in my ramblings and hopefully this will give you a bit more insight to what is what and why.

Picture 1 shows a very thin lightweight powder bound csm.

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This type of laminate is used as an interface between gel and ordinary csm if tissue laminate is not available or required in a build spec.
It can also be used as an interface between certain heavy duty foams that are used in the industry.
Its messy to use and quite expensive.

Pic 2 shows an ordinary csm.

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The 'grain' is much more pronounced as you can see and as you know this is what has been used throughout Mikes project.
It is very easy to use,does not cost the earth and it what is generally sold by Halfrauds and the like for patch repairs.

Pic 3 shows a woven roving.

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This is used for 'bulking up' on various areas which keeps the weight down but the strength high.
Again not too expensive but can be a pain to use as the ribbons tend to separate as they are laminated and you end up with the stuff wrapped around rollers and you can get in a hell of a mess.
Been there ,done that.
It is also best used on large flat surfaces as the weave does not lend itself well to being pushed into tight corners etc.
Commonly used on truck bodies and you can often see a chequred pattern showing through a paint job.
This is the footprint of the matt showing.

Pic 4 shows what a combi matt looks like although I have clearly laid a csm on top of the woven as I dont have any here at the moment.
Used for very high strength areas,quite difficult to work and heavy from the outset.

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What needs to be considered with any laminating is what is best for the job.
Obviously a very heavy combi to make moulds with is dumb as is using a powder bound csm.
Enourmous strength can be obtained by using different types of foam, balsa scrim, foam scrim, flat foam high density foam blah blah blah and then glassing over the top.

We recently chopped the back end out of a brand new 64ft power boat to fit a gyroscopic stabiliser system (£68k just for the gyro ) and used foam to make mounting beds and then incredibly just 3 layers of Diagonap laminate to tie it into the hull structure.
Diagonap is a specific requirement laminate for this type of job and has the weave laid out in a diagonal pattern which gives it the strength but is relatively light weight and as some of my colleagues found out really difficult to use :lol:

I wont bore you with any more crap now but you get the gist of what is explained here I hope.
Again thank you for your very kind comments.

More tomorrow.

cheers
P

gelmonkey
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Post by gelmonkey »

Evening Gents
Simple stuff tonight.
Cut the main laminates and four full length strips about 3" wide.

The main sections of glass were cut to overlap the nose cone glass by about 3".
Just makes it stronger thats all.

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Usual wet and bung it on.


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Then turning the mould on its sides ran the strips up the internal edges.
This just ties the top and bottom together and makes a very strong structure.

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Make sure it has had a good roller and we end up with this.

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All that we need to do is to cut the magic ingredient stick that in and then one final laminate and we are done with the main section.

Cheers
P

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Ian Anderson
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Post by Ian Anderson »

Paul

Fascinating as always!

Have you mentioned to Mike you only work on boats and that the last picture is actually the correct way up.

all he has to do is mount a 225 mariner on the back and he could have a fairly quick but unstable boat!

Ian
Owner of an "On the Road" GT40 Replica by DAX powered by 3.9Hotwre Efi, worked over by DJ Motors. EFi Working but still does some kangaroo at low revs (Damn the speed limits) In to paint shop 18/03/08.

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Post by topcatcustom »

Haha powerboat skimming at the pod!
TC

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Post by gelmonkey »

Mad as a box of frogs the pair of you.

p

gelmonkey
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Post by gelmonkey »

Hello children,are you sitting comfortably?
Then I'll begin (that brings back memories for some of you now does'nt it,Mike Perry, Ian Tom? :lol: )
Ok so tonights nonsense.

Trimmed down the mould in the usual way.

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Now the secret ingredient.
4mm PU foam is being used as it replaces the laminate layers by 3 and yet gives considerable strength but not the extra weight.

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Now I laid out the foam on the drive and then used my final laminate to make a template from which to cut the foam.

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This was then cut with laminate shears for a nice clean edge and then final trimmed to fit.

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Once happy with the postioning I ran a marker pen around the
perimeter so that the foam could go back in exactly the same place once the bonding agent went on.

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When I showed my little splitter project I used a chemical called Crestomer and the same stuff has been used again but a different blend.
This stuff is known as 1196 and it massively strong and sticks like the proverbial.

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Once mixed up with catalyst (an organic peroxide known as MEKP) the mould was then buttered up like this.
Note that the Crestomer has been kept inside the line one to keep it all neat but also to allow for the final laminate resin to soak into the edges of the foam and keep everything locked together.

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And then the foam went in and was rollered out with a clean gel sleeve ,the same thing as was used to gel the mould and the final panel.

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The curve is quite pronounced within the moulds so I covered it with a masking film and then placed bin bags full of sharp sand directly onto that.
This holds the foam in place whilst curing takes place.

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All that is needed now is the final laminate, an outboard mounting point and the body fabrication is complete.

cheers
P

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Ian Anderson
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Post by Ian Anderson »

Paul

Jokes aside I am fascinated

Your work is inspiring

Ian
Owner of an "On the Road" GT40 Replica by DAX powered by 3.9Hotwre Efi, worked over by DJ Motors. EFi Working but still does some kangaroo at low revs (Damn the speed limits) In to paint shop 18/03/08.

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Post by gelmonkey »

Thank you Ian
You are very kind.

P

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Post by gelmonkey »

Okay then
The last bit of glassing to the main section.

Wet out and laminated the last layer and we finally end up with this.

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This will now be left untouched for about 2 weeks to cure and shrink before anymore is done.
Things left to do are relaes it from the mould (duh) final finish the gelcoat.polish it up to a high gloss and coat the inside with a black satin finish flowcoat.
Monday evening will see the tub mould released and the whole process starts all over again.!!

NO MORE I hear you cry
:lol:

cheers
P

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Post by gelmonkey »

Evening all
Release the tub night then.
After the bit of bother getting the main body section to release it was hoped that the tub sections would behave themselves !
All of the bolts were undone and then in with the paint scraper and then lots of filler spreaders tapped in.
These had to go in under the locking edges of the mould and if you look carefully you can see this in the first pic.

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Spreaders are really good to use as they are plastic and dont damage the mould when you put them in and tap them around.

The top was a pig to get off as the laminates has shrunk back as they do and pulled down really tight to the plug.
Again Mike you wont be hanging the tub on the wall either.
Got the bugger off though and the bottom part was just the same.
Next up came the sides and these fell off.

Image

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The next bit ( the rear section with the 'chute box) which has a huge potential for being very difficult was up next.
So after wazzing back the edges on the inside and a mountain of spreaders I set too.

Little beauty came off sweet as ya like.
This is my concentrating look ok.

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And this is my 'I'm a smart arse look.'
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Mr Cooper if you are reading this there is no need for you to comment thank you very much

So at the end of play we have a fully released mould looking like this.

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The top and bottom sections need a samall amount of work to make them right but nothing major.

Image

Catch you later

cheers
P

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Post by ChrisJC »

Cool.

I can't wait to see what it'll look like when finished as I have no idea how they'll all fit together!

Chris.
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Series IIA 4.6 V8
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Post by kiwicar »

:whs
Neither can I :D
Mike
poppet valves rule!

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Ian Anderson
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Post by Ian Anderson »

kiwicar wrote::whs
Neither can I :D
Mike
Well that parachute thing has to be attached to the crotch strap to make sure you do not try to chicken out!

That is why the call it going "balls out"

Ian
Owner of an "On the Road" GT40 Replica by DAX powered by 3.9Hotwre Efi, worked over by DJ Motors. EFi Working but still does some kangaroo at low revs (Damn the speed limits) In to paint shop 18/03/08.

gelmonkey
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Post by gelmonkey »

AH HA there you are.
Well its been a week or so now since things happened out in the workshop and the reason for this is that the main business has been incredibly busy and most nights have just been about invoicing and catching breath for the next day really.
Please don't think that I complain to one and all because that is not the case indeed quite the opposite.
Anyway back to the plot....
All of the tub sections have been sanded down and polished up and now it is a case of seeing if it all goes back together (hope so).

So bolt tab A into tab B and we end up with this.

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Nail on one of the side panels so..

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And then the other side panel...

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Finally the top...

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The waxing was up next and if you look closely you may be able to see the smears of wax prior to buffing up.

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The wax was worked well into the split lines .

Image.

Three coats on the side top and bottom panels but five on the chute panel for obvious reasons.
And that was that for tonight.
Gelling could have been started but the temperature dropped a lot last night and the same is due to happen again this evening so not wanting to rush things gelling will take place tomorrow morning before boat work and then before and after dinner.
In some of the pics you will see a darker shade of grey showing through and this is down to sanding out some of the lumps and bumps that have transferred from the plug.
Ideally the plug would have been Formica sheathed for a super smooth finish but it is not too much of a bother.
The final panel will just need a bit of extra work once released thats all.

A point to note here for anyone thinking about having a go for themselves,..
Allow plenty of time for curing (as if this has not been mentioned before ) and you will be able to bolt it all back up again without any problems.
Pull the mould too soon and it will twist to hell and back and then all of your efforts will have been wasted.

Everything tonight went smoothly and without fuss for that simple reason.

Later
P

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