Priming again

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Pitschi
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Priming again

Post by Pitschi »

I have read some posts on priming but have to ask again. Helped my buddy to put a 4.6 Ltr. engine in his car, mounted all ancillaries and started to prime because the engine was not running for about a year or two the seller said but it was running fine the last time. First tried with petroleum jellyand a driller, no result. Then with a driller for about 5 minutes, no result. We tried this for 10 minutes, no result. No pressure at all, no change in drillmotion, no oil getting up to the valve gears, no nothing. We removed the oil pump basic plate and checked the pressure relief valve, it seems okay, it is running free. Small marks on the basic plate, not unusual I would say. We have put in enough oil, so the dip stick shows a little above the high mark, oil filter is full. Some rocker arms can be pushed down by hand, so no oil at the lifters.

Any idea?



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Post by ChrisJC »

Oil pickup pipe not sealed against the block (missing gasket / o-ring depending on which one) ?

Turning the drill the wrong way?

Chris.
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Pitschi
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Post by Pitschi »

Oil pickup pipe not sealed against the block (missing gasket / o-ring depending on which one) ? Buddy checked again and it is okay

Turning the drill the wrong way? Clockwise

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Ian Anderson
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Post by Ian Anderson »

Try overfilling the sump to get the oil level higher than the pump

Prime it with the drill then drain back to correct level before starting

Ian
Owner of an "On the Road" GT40 Replica by DAX powered by 3.9Hotwre Efi, worked over by DJ Motors. EFi Working but still does some kangaroo at low revs (Damn the speed limits) In to paint shop 18/03/08.

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Post by ChrisJC »

Have you got a remote oil filter or cooler? If you have, you can backfill the pump through the hoses.

Chris.
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unstable load
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Post by unstable load »

Possibly a dumb question, but isn't the 4.6 oil pump driven by the crankshaft? Or has the engine got an earlier distributor type front cover fitted?
Cheers,
John

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Post by mgbv8 »

unstable load wrote:Possibly a dumb question, but isn't the 4.6 oil pump driven by the crankshaft? Or has the engine got an earlier distributor type front cover fitted?
I guess if he is saying that he's tried jelly and a drill that it must have a dissy driven oil pump. What we dont know is if it has a remote oil filter housing? If it does then back filling can help.

Perry Stephenson

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Now looking for 8 seconds with a SBC engine

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nVscbPHgue0&list=UUqIlXfSAoiZ--GyG4tfRrjw



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Pitschi
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Post by Pitschi »

Okay guys, Thanks at first.

Buddy gave me the following informations: new pickup pipe gasket mountet, overfilled the sump and drilled again, reached 20 PSI on the clock. All that with smacking and gurgling noises. In between the pressure was gone, was up again etc. the drill moved light again, then heavy again, so pressure on and off. Dizzy mounted, engine started and approx. 20 PSI for 20 seconds, then no pressure at all, you can hear that the lifters went empty again :-(. Horrible sound again.

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Post by DEVONMAN »

I would say that the pressure relief valve is sticking open.
or you have a leak on the suction side of the pump. Check the gasket /joint between the front cover and the block at the point where the suction gallery crosses it.

Also what thickness gasket are you using for the oil pump cover.
Some aftermarket gaskets are way too thick. OE ones are paper thin.

Good luck,
Denis
1950 A40 Devon Hotrod with 5.0 twin turbo RV8.
EDIS8 wasted spark, Holley Injection.
Been as far as the Moon and back in 57 years of driving. Same Car, 5 engine upgrades !!!


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Post by sidecar »

Hard to believe that the simple connection between the pickup and the block could be an issue yet is was on Mr. Muscle Manta's 4.6. The pump was pulling oil and air and sending that mix down the oil ways. The flange on the pickup proved not to be flat, a file sorted it out!

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Post by mgbv8 »

DEVONMAN wrote:I would say that the pressure relief valve is sticking open.
or you have a leak on the suction side of the pump. Check the gasket /joint between the front cover and the block at the point where the suction gallery crosses it.

Also what thickness gasket are you using for the oil pump cover.
Some aftermarket gaskets are way too thick. OE ones are paper thin.

Good luck,
Denis
Spot on Denis! I was going to say that. I've had 2 mates in the last 12 months with the same issue. BUT, both times it was cheap paper thin Black timing cover gaskets as opposed to the normal thick blue ones. I almost had to go and do one myself as my mate could not believe it was this as there was no oil leaking out from the timing cover. But he pulled it off and found that the raised lip on the cover had cut through the thin gasket.
This was allowing air to be sucked in from the timing cover flange and was making some unusual noises during priming, and then when the drill stopped it was making burping noises back in the sump.

Perry

Perry Stephenson

MGB GT + Rover V8

9.62 @ 137.37mph

Now looking for 8 seconds with a SBC engine

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nVscbPHgue0&list=UUqIlXfSAoiZ--GyG4tfRrjw



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eg3avnsNKrc&index=2&list=FLqIlXfSAoiZ--GyG4tfRrjw

Pitschi
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Post by Pitschi »

Buddy is using a normal gasket for the pump cover and the thin one for the timing cover as he changed the front cover from the 3.5 to the 4.6. He will replace it with the thick blue one this week. I'll let you know.

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Post by DEVONMAN »

Pitschi wrote:Buddy is using a normal gasket for the pump cover and the thin one for the timing cover as he changed the front cover from the 3.5 to the 4.6. He will replace it with the thick blue one this week. I'll let you know.
When you say "a normal gasket for the pump cover" do you mean one that is very thin? The correct gasket should be very thin for the pump and not one of the thicker aftermarket types.

There are two types of timing cover gasket shapes available for RV8.
Many people don't realise.

The early one (usually thick blue) is a different shape to the later serp type.
The shape differs near the water passages and also because the 4.0/4.6 don't use the suction gallery through the block, this hole may not be punched out on a later type gaskets.

So, the gasket should match the cover you are using not the engine year.
Regards Denis
1950 A40 Devon Hotrod with 5.0 twin turbo RV8.
EDIS8 wasted spark, Holley Injection.
Been as far as the Moon and back in 57 years of driving. Same Car, 5 engine upgrades !!!


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Pitschi
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Post by Pitschi »

Thanks Dennis,

will inform my buddy, he has to check again I think.

Kind regards
Pitschi

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Post by Pitschi »

Okay guys,

Many THANKS from my buddy Martin for giving him the hint with the front cover gasket. He changed it again to the blue one. All problems solved! :-).

Pressure between 20 and 40 PSI depending on revs.

Kind regards
Pitschi

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